F4U-1A Corsair

[kevjon]

Here is a new WIP project from me.

This plane will eventually go into a scene with my Zero and is also one of my favorite WWII fighters.

PS I'll be continuing with the textures of my Flitzer in between modelling this aircraft.

[kiwi123]

cool, will be following this closely !

[cobra6]

Maybe you'll finish it sooner than Ronnie ;)

Cobra 6

[kevjon]

Well mine won't be anywhere near as detailed as Ronnie's. I will only be modelling the bits that are visible and even then simplifying them where I can get away with it.

I don't think any of the WIP corsairs have been finished yet so see how I go with this one.

[kevjon]

Some more progress over the last few hours.

[torrikabe]

looking great so far.
im keeping on eye of this.;)

cheers for kev.

[denders]

Go for it Kev. There can never be too many corsairs!

[kiwi123]

Coming along very well !

[zenmarcel]

Yeah, I hope U will have some more time than me to finish it ;)
I will follow your work !

Zen

[Lukem]

Have you got the wings on yet?!:D

Seriously, very quick and very smooth - great work Kev!:) Looking forward to seeing the finished product.

[Mirko]

Great subject! And looks very good until now.
:salute:

[raf]

Looking nice. One day I'll try to do modeling your way, smooth and simple. The picture of Zero you made, and use on your avatar must be one of the most photorealisic renders of WWII aircraft ever.

[JackSkieczius]

very cool.

been thinking of doing one of them as well. tho i must first finish my wildcat

[kevjon]

Thanks everyone for your encouragement and kind words.

@zenmarcel
Hope you find time. Yours is progressing well and is really looking the part. I've put some minor observations about your model in your thead. Hope it is helpful.

@raf
I admire your panel by panel technique but requires too much skill (and time) for me. I think there is a lot that can be done with a good bump map and fortunately 3D max has good bump mapping abilities with both scanline and MR renderers. I am adopting some of your modelling techiques on this aircraft with regard to blends between meshes.

@JackSkieczius
Interesting to hear your thinking of the Corsair next because I was really tossing up between modelling the Wildcat and the Corsair for this project. Both go well with my Zero's. I might do the Wildcat next.

[digiartist]

great start Kevin......looking at just the fuselage like that makes you realise how difficult it must have been for the pilot to see past that long nose for landings!

[raf]

@raf
I admire your panel by panel technique but requires too much skill (and time) for me. I think there is a lot that can be done with a good bump map and fortunately 3D max has good bump mapping abilities with both scanline and MR renderers. I am adopting some of your modelling techiques on this aircraft with regard to blends between meshes.

You said it right.

I see that fillet between fuselage and horizontal stabilizer. How do you feel about doing thing this way. It should be slightly faster that way.

[kevjon]

I see that fillet between fuselage and horizontal stabilizer. How do you feel about doing thing this way.I still need to refine these fillets a lot more before collapsing to high poly. It is definitely a lot faster and when done properly looks better than pulling the stabilizer from the fuselage mesh and lot neater and smoother too. Thanks for the inspiration.

@digiartist
Your not wrong about the nose .... it just goes on for ever. Hose nose is very appropriate. I just started modelling the propeller and used my zero prop as a starting point. I had to scale the zero prop 150% bigger to fit the corsair. Its prop is huge, no wonder they bent the wings.

[kevjon]

Further update with its massive propellor in place.

Started detailing the fuselage & Cowling, but most of the work with the Corsair is on the underside of the aircraft......so lots of fiddly stuff there yet to do.

[Martocticvs]

I would start taking bets on you finishing yours before Ronnie... BUT I don't think I'd make much money out of that haha. Nice work on her so far mate!

[mrys]

Hi Kev! Good start!:D I like your Corsair and wait for finished one!

Besides, you are really fearless man!:cool: If only Ronnie will find some time to visit this thread you will know, what you were made wrong:lol::lol::lol:.

[kevjon]

cheers guys

If only Ronnie will find some time to visit this thread you will know, what you were made wrongBetter not to know, I can proceed a lot faster that way.

[Lukem]

Nice work mate! Looks great with the prop in place.

[kiwi123]

cheers guys

Better not to know, I can proceed a lot faster that way.

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[winlen1]

Looks great

[kevjon]

Here is most of the detail added to the underside of the fuselage. I still need to add 2 catapult hooks each side of the engine compartment vent door but I'll do that once the wings are located which will help me place them correctly.

[JackSkieczius]

very cool Kevjon, looking very accurate thus far.
i have a little 1:18 scale toy version of the F4U, and when i compare the two, they match.

oh, will you be animating the cowl flaps?

[kevjon]

Thanks Jack

I have no knowledge of the animation side of 3D max so wouldn't be animating the cowl flaps. I build all of my 3D aircraft for inflight renders and all photos seem to show the cowl flaps in the closed position. I do however seperate all the movable bits of the aircraft so they could be animated later on if ever required. Also landing gear could easily be added if needed.

I'm using the "Detail and Scale" book of the F4U for photo reference for all the detail on the aircraft. It seems to cover most of it pretty well.

PS Check out Skyraiders Corsair as he is animating most parts of the aircraft including the wing folds.

[Mirko]

Hi Kev
nice details
Have you already modeled the engine? It would be possible to see it?

:salute:

[kevjon]

Have you already modeled the engine?


Not yet. I do not have any drawings of the engine so I am going to have model it by eye from photographs. My engine won't win and modelling prizes however as I tend to keep them simple as most of the detail does not show when rendered. The cowl opening of the corsair is larger than most so I'll probably have to do more detail than I normally do.

[JackSkieczius]

cool kev, so cowl flaps are closed, but did you know that large reverse scoop on the bottom that you have open also opens and closes? this is as far as i know.
and there are also little flaps on the bottom edge of the inner wing area to let more air thru the wing air intakes.

wasn't sure if you knew this or not. its just one bit of useless info i know about the F4U.

[kevjon]

Yep, there is a lot of stuff on the underside of the corsair wing and fuselage making it quite busy. If you like animating things there is plenty of bits on the corsair to have fun with.

[digiartist]

wow, you're making great progress with this Kevin! I don't know much more than the general shape of the Corsair but what you have so far looks nice and detailed!
Of course I'm sure Ronnie will have something to say about accuracy :p

[Evan]

Nice work Kevin! I'm also not very familiar with this aircraft but your modelling skills are top notch.

[kevjon]

Cheers guys.

No problems with giving crits on accuracy issues as I have pretty good reference on the Corsair that should allow me to build something that is reasonably accurate come render time. I'm really posting progress images for the MM members as I like looking at the progress of other members work.

For Ronnie, I'm going to put the 2 degree rotation angle on the fin which is designed into the aircraft to counter the engine torque.

[raf]

For Ronnie, I'm going to put the 2 degree rotation angle on the fin which is designed into the aircraft to counter the engine torque.

:lol: but first you have to make sure that it is exactly 2 degrees, no more, no less.

Now that you mention that angle, I can't remember seeing it in any blueprints of single prop planes though a lot should have it. Then again, wing twist is often not shown either. :(

[kevjon]

All the modelling of the fuselage is now completed.

Now onto the cockpit.

Now that you mention that angle, I can't remember seeing it in any blueprints of single prop planes though a lot should have it.
I have it shown on the Corsair plans in my "Maru Mechanic" and "Design with Precision" books. Never really knew to look for it until Ronnie told me that the P51 had 1 degree twist in the fin. I don't think it would affect the look of any renders if people decide to skip this kind of detail.

[Galgot]

Very nice already ! And good to have a ennemy for your A6m...Mmmmh can imagine some good fight scenes here...:p
Cheers

[mrys]

Nice going. Very clean mesh. I think, that we will see your Corsair finished before Ronnie's one. Wait for more:)

[Skyraider3D]

Corsair's looking good mate. Great progress! Wait till you get to the wings though, they're a bit of a pain :)

I don't really want to comment too much on it, as I know you're tying to keep the detail to a functional level, but some areas might need looking at (pls excuse the "list", it just makes things more easy to read :)):
- cockpit looks a tad large (with & volume). Through photo comparissons I found I need to scale mine down too;
- behind the cockpit there should be a bit of a knick in the spine, subtle but noticable;
- the area around the intercooler hatch doesn't look right (ignoring the simplified hatch mechanism), check the Design With Precision (DwP) F4U-1D right side view drawing and note the "step". The fuselage belly sort of curves inwards underneath the hatch;

Hopefully you're using the DwP drawings. The Maru Mechanic (MM) ones contain numerous errors and should be avoided. Also the MM factory drawing snippets are of limited use, as they relate to a prototype with different flight control arrangement on the wings.

No doubt you'll finish yours quicker than mine. I'd be lucky to touch MAX ever again in spare time... too many nappies to change now! ;)

[raf]

I have it shown on the Corsair plans in my "Maru Mechanic" and "Design with Precision" books. Never really knew to look for it until Ronnie told me that the P51 had 1 degree twist in the fin. I don't think it would affect the look of any renders if people decide to skip this kind of detail.

No it wouldn't, unless you are a kind of person who couldn't get a good night sleep unless you new it is modeled in. :D

It is of much more help if you try to get a plane in some simulation or just doing some calculations for fun. Together with exact airfoil data, wing twist, incidence angles, control surface deflections and so on. Oh... don't listen to me. :rolleyes:

[kevjon]

Thanks Galgot and Mrys

@Skyraider3d

Wait till you get to the wings though, they're a bit of a pain
Yeh, they look kind of tricky around the intake area. I haven't quite figured out how I am going to tackle that just yet but have a couple of ideas on how I might approach it from a modelling point of view.

cockpit looks a tad large (with & volume). Through photo comparissons I found I need to scale mine down too;
Maybe, but it would be a substantial amount of work to make changes to this area and is unlikely to make any difference to final renders. My cockpit is spot on to the blueprints though and I am happy with how it looks. If you have a measurement across width of the cockpit, let me know so I can check how far out I am.

behind the cockpit there should be a bit of a knick in the spine, subtle but noticable; Can't really see it any general photos I have, so no need for me to make any changes. If you mean under the canopy, then it doesn't matter as the canopy covers it.

the area around the intercooler hatch doesn't look right (ignoring the simplified hatch mechanism), check the Design With Precision (DwP) F4U-1D right side view drawing and note the "step". The fuselage belly sort of curves inwards underneath the hatch;
Ahh, thanks for that. I do have some photos of this area but the angle of the photos doesnt really allow me to work out how this area looks. Once I get the wings in place, I'll do a bit of tweaking of this area. It looks like a similar set up under there like the hellcat.

Hopefully you're using the DwP drawings.
I'm using the ones in the Kagero publication "Chance Vought Corsair Vol 1" as these are the most recent plans around on the corsair and contain cross sectional information. These plans may not be perfect (the engine drawing is not even close) but I am happy with how the corsair is coming out.

@raf and skyraider.
Just want to keep 3D aircraft as a hobby and fun and finish the project in a reasonable time frame. I approach modelling with final renders in mind and maybe one day animation. As I have no interest in doing close up renders there is no need for me to model every tiny detail so I do tend to simplify unimportant details that I think still look good when rendered. As far as accuracy is concerned I try to get it as right as I can, but small inaccuracies in my own work or other peoples work does not really both me only the glaringly obvious ones.

[kiwi123]

Well said Kevin !

Some people like to make CAD models, other people like to make art. I always work with the motto: "if it looks good, it is good".


Having said that, you really need to know what sort of images you want to make with your models, I usually go a bit overboard with details as I like to do closeups. But then again, textures usually do not hold up to it when using 4k res.

[Skyraider3D]

The knick behind the cockpit is best seen in a rearview:
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1206241/L/
(ignore the fact it's a birdcage, doesn't make a difference forthe spine)
It's quite characteristic I find, and 95% of artists miss it, which is a shame.

[kevjon]

Ah yeh, I can sort of see it. But the rear flange of the 1A's canopy covers it. IMO not worth spending time on.

Some people like to make CAD models, other people like to make art. I always work with the motto: "if it looks good, it is good".
To true. If I was modelling for technical publication I would approach the modelling differently.

Having said that, you really need to know what sort of images you want to make with your models, I usually go a bit overboard with details as I like to do closeups. But then again, textures usually do not hold up to it when using 4k res.
This is so true another good reason not to go overboard on detail as the textures do not hold up, especially the bump map. I like to do renders similar to my avatar so no need to go crazy with small details on control horns, engines or cockpits. I'd be better off putting that time into improving my pilot figure and my texturing skills.

[mrys]

Some people like to make CAD models, other people like to make art. I always work with the motto: "if it looks good, it is good".


Agree! Always exist the border, going behind is nonsense. Level of detail depend on for what we are making the model. If I know, that there will be no cockpit interior visible - I model it only in very basic form. If I know that engine will be covered on all render I model only this part which will be visible. etc, etc. On the other side sometimes small, almost non noticeable detail can improve final quality. General Wiek's rule "f it looks good, it is good" is also main for me.

But sometimes "hardcore" detail and ultra accurate modeling is what I want for my satisfaction. I would never said that sombody's model is worse only because has less detail then other's. I saw very simple models look great on final render and very detailed look ugly. So I love Ronnie's Corsair and admire his wey to perfection and also love Kevin's Corsair, which is more then enough good for me.

So we will have two (or more) fantastic F4U on this forum!

[Skyraider3D]

"if it looks good, it is good"That's all good and well, but in case of the cockpit it doesn't look good. It looks too big and having just compared the Kagero drawings with those of Minoru and Watanabe I can indeed confirm that the cockpit on the Kagero drawings is significantly bigger. Ironically this may in part be caused by the characteristic spine knick being ignored on the Kagero drawings, which automatically increases the size of the cockpit to compensate for the spine ending up higher.

Kevin, as you know I've compared over a dozen Corsair drawings and you could have taken my advice on the Minoru and Watanabe drawings... ;)

Anyway, if you're happy with it all fine. Just trying to help.

*returns to nappies*

[digiartist]

Personally speaking, when I look at art work by Taylor,Trudgian or Turner I can sometimes see obvious faults in their depiction of particularly aircraft, and I certainly wouldn't call myself an expert on aircraft technical details, but you know what? I don't care.....there is a reason their artwork is so desired, and that is it's evocative quality of a time, place and action.
I'm totally with you Kevin on when it comes to thinking of what your model will look like in it's final render scene rahter than getting hung up on details. Obviously there is a real appreciation for those people who put in a ton of research and come up with incredibly accurate model work, but for me the enjoyment isn't building a hyper detailed 3d model but putting it into a scene that hopefully represents a slice of history.

[kevjon]

Kevin, as you know I've compared over a dozen Corsair drawings and you could have taken my advice on the Minoru and Watanabe drawings...I don't have the Watanabe drawings or know where they can be sourced. I chose the Kagero drawings because they had the fuselage cross sections which I find useful while modelling and they are the most recently published set. The minoru drawings do not contain fuselage cross sections. I am happy with the Corsair that is evolving from the Kagero plans and the size of the cockpit. I can't see that it is too big and neither will be 99.99% of people who view the finished artwork, but I'll take your word for it.

I'll be using the Minoru drawings for the cross section of the wing as this information is not included in the Kagero drawings.

It looks too big and having just compared the Kagero drawings with those of Minoru and Watanabe I can indeed confirm that the cockpit on the Kagero drawings is significantly bigger.
I have overlayed the Kagero plan on the Minoru plan and I get and exact match with regard to cockpit width and length. When I overlay the side view of the Kagero over the Minoru, I can see that the Kagero is a little larger but I think using the word significantly is exaggerating a bit.

I'm totally with you Kevin on when it comes to thinking of what your model will look like in it's final render scene rahter than getting hung up on details. Obviously there is a real appreciation for those people who put in a ton of research and come up with incredibly accurate model work, but for me the enjoyment isn't building a hyper detailed 3d model but putting it into a scene that hopefully represents a slice of history.Yep, I just want to do some 3D aviation artwork with a corsair in it. Close ups won't be required.

[Lukem]

Good for you Kev!:)

I have to say (my own feelings here - or work ethic if you prefer) - if I know something is wrong on one of my models (all three of them:D) that part will drive me mad until I remodel it.

To me, your model looks like a Corsair, although admittedly I don't know the plane in any great detail.

[Skyraider3D]

...or know where they can be sourced.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

PS. Check your e-mail from 8 April this year...

[giant551]

Well Kev its looking just the part:) It will look great together with your Zero

[chrisken]

I have overlayed the Kagero plan on the Minoru plan and I get and exact match with regard to cockpit width and length. When I overlay the side view of the Kagero over the Minoru, I can see that the Kagero is a little larger but I think using the word significantly is exaggerating a bit.

Yep, I just want to do some 3D aviation artwork with a corsair in it. Close ups won't be required.[/QUOTE]

I have watched this thread with great intrest and have a few comments. Firstly who set the base line for drawings accuracy ? I gather Skyraider does not have a set of factory drawings or he would have rolled them out by now. So who has photographs of the aircraft on jacks ,wheels retracted , and in normal flying attitude.The picture would have to be taken with a camera on a tripod and fitted with a shift lens of the correct focal length to compensate for parallelax error and the film plane would have to be positioned at exactly 90 degrees to the aircraft centreline?ANSWER : "nobody me thinks"! ,and that is what is needed for a subjective comparison of all alleged drawing infringments.

kev I have attached a drawing from 1968 which shows dimensions and Skyraiders little bump. I am assuming that the guy who drew this series did his job well. He may have had an aircraft to check his work against. After all it was nearly for 40 years ago and there were still a few F4u punching holes in the sky.I got them somewhere on the web a couple of years ago.

Anyway enough of this , I think your aircraft is fine and I doubt anybody will notice the lack of bump (Skyraider excluded) in renders unless you plan doing profile shots. Skyraider you mesh is a true as you can possibly achive reproduction of the highest quality but as kev says its a HOBBY to him.

[Nils]

@raf and skyraider.
Just want to keep 3D aircraft as a hobby and fun and finish the project in a reasonable time frame. I approach modelling with final renders in mind and maybe one day animation. As I have no interest in doing close up renders there is no need for me to model every tiny detail so I do tend to simplify unimportant details that I think still look good when rendered. As far as accuracy is concerned I try to get it as right as I can, but small inaccuracies in my own work or other peoples work does not really both me only the glaringly obvious ones.

Ditto to that Kevin :) and congrats on another good looking model!
(maybe one shouldn't stick ones head out, ... but I have even made models with no blueprints, just used approximate measurements and my eyes :rolleyes: )

[Skyraider3D]

Chrisken, Paul Matt's drawing, though impressive as it looks, is outdated and contains too many errors to list, including a canopy that's too big. Check: http://skyraider.allaboutwarfare.com/files/temp/corsair_profiles_compared.jpg - the shaded one is Watanabe's, red is Matt's and green is from the Vought heritage website and not even worth looking at.

Of course I referred to factory drawings when comparing the blueprints, as well as photographs (airshow pictures provide decent sideviews, which can highlight obvious errors in drawings. See: http://www.military-meshes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1499). As I mentioned many times I've compared over a dozen drawings and after looking at Corsair photos and drawings for 2.5 years I thought my findings would be more appreciated.

Here are the blueprints, by the way: http://www.f4ucorsair.com/tdata/blueprints.html
Unfortunately the format they're in isn't too suitable for 3D modelling. But they're fine for comparing other, more useful drawings. Watanabe's drawings were best, the Minoru ones are pretty close too.

As for significant vs insignificant, don't forget a model is 3D, not just a sideview. A bit too long + a bit too tall + a bit too wide ends up with a lot of extra space inside the canopy bubble and the pilot will be dwarfed. Again something most artist get wrong.

Anyway I will end it here as the resistance to accuracy is clear. I thought this was Military Meshes, not a fantasy art board. Of course everyone is free to take on board whatever they wish, but to discard valid comments it a bit sad. I hope this forum isn't slowly turning into another CGTalk, which in my personal opinion would be a pity. Perhaps I should have ignored this topic or post a CGTalk style reply, like...

Woohoo fantastic OMG!!!!1one etc etc :lol:

More seriously, KevJon is doing a great job. I just offered some free advice so he can make it even better if he wishes to.

[kiwi123]

I do not see any resistance to accuracy at all. I see acceptance of sanity.

[kevjon]

@Chrisken
Thanks for the Paul Matt drawing. I haven't seen that one before. I only have the wing and engine to go now and there is a few measurements and angles on that drawing which may prove useful.

@Nils
but I have even made models with no blueprints, just used approximate measurements and my eyes Haha, yep for some planes there are no drawings so this would be the only way.

@Skyraider
but to discard valid comments it a bit sad.
Not really sure what you mean ? If you mean I'm discarding your comments about the width of the cockpit or the slight flattening of the spine near the canopy then I better explain further my reasons.

Cockpit width implications
If I was to narrow my cockpit, I would have to narrow the fuselage. This would then require me to reduce the diameter of the cowl to fit the new fuselage and readjust the fin and stabilizer to suit the new narrower fuselage. Then I would have to cut all the detail into the new fuselage again as well as the cowl, fin and stabilizer. I would then have to rebuild the internal walls of my cockpit and then reshape the canopy and recut out all the glass again. At a guess I would say that would be about 15 to 20 hours of extra work and practically a total rebuild.

I'm sure you can appreciate why I am not going to modify the width of my cockpit. Even if I wanted to do it (which I don't) , how wide should I make it ? Some one out there may have a drawing which shows the width of the cockpit but is that accurate ? How was that width obtained ?

Flattening of spine behind the canopy.
Not quite the same amount of work as above but similar deal. It is a detail that is not important enough to me to spend another 5 or 6 hours on. I did eventually find an inflight photo of corsairs that shows it more clearly so I know what your talking about now.

Bottom of the fuselage
No problem with that one. Once I get the wing in place I'll do some more work there to correct that part. In hindsight I should have detailed this area last. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

Please continue to point out the faults in my Corsair or other planes (if you wish) and back it up where you can with a link to a photo which shows the problem more clearly. I can then make a decision about whether it is worth fixing based on how much work is involved and whether it is a big deal or a minor detail that isn't important to me. If I decide not to fix it or change it, don't be annoyed by that. However if that is going to annoy you, its probably best to fill my thread up with heaps of praise :lol:


@Kiwi
Spot on. I don't want this mesh to become Corsair "The Never Ending story 2".

Thanks everyone for the healthy debate about accuracy and levels of detail.

Cockpit is nearly done so wings are next, then engine.

[Skyraider3D]

Kevin, the discarding valid comments comment wasn't aimed at you but at some of the other folks who jumped the "who needs accuracy" bandwagon.

Regarding the suggested changes, have a look at FFD modifiers. I am 100% sure you can get the knick and scale down canopy bubble in under 10 minutes using a single FFD modifier. It won't be perfect but it will look good enough, which is the main goal afterall as we all agree ;)

If you haven't used FFD modifiers before, basically it works as follows: select a bunch of vertices you want to alter (i.e. cockpit area) and apply one of the FFD modifiers. Then tweak the control points till you're happy.

I think you can get away by slightly tapering and moving down the top four control points on an FFD 2x2x2 box. It will add the knick and reduce the volume of the bubble in one go. Bringing the rear four points in next will make it a tad shorter to maintain proportions. Multiple meshes can be selected at the same time too (just add a Select Poly on top before the FFD box). Hope this helps, if not now then for the future, as FFD modifiers are amongst the most powerful modelling tools in MAX.

And a 10 minute fix isn't too insane is it? :)

[mrys]

Kevin, the discarding valid comments comment wasn't aimed at you but at some of the other folks who jumped the "who needs accuracy" bandwagon.

I don't think, that there is such bandwagon here.:) And I don't think, that there is anyone who is against accuracy. I was always impressed by your work on model and way to perfection - I know this way, cause for a long years I was draftsman and looking for accuracy was my duty. Even now, If I find something wrong in my model, even small thing, I'am ill, and want to correct this. Sometimes it is possible sometimes not. And sometimes I had to say myself stop. I was always happy, then you found any inaccuracies in my or other's works. It was also source of knowledge about unique airplane or model technique.

When I looking at my models I see them also as accurate as I could get based on sources I had. In most cases even less detail should be good enough. And personally I hate to model one thing longer then few months. I was in this trap with my La 11 and lost heart for them...

So Ronnie, it was no voices against accuracy (and not against your notices of course), but that everyone use such accuracy as they need in unique model.:D

[Nils]

I guess I qualify for the "some other folks" group, but don't get me wrong, I do NOT see accuracy as something negative, on the contrary, I really admire those who creates masterpieces down to the smallest detail, I really do. It's impressing to see the amount of work you put into your models to make then look real, after all most of us do this as an amusing hobby - though it's not hard to spot the professionals amongst us when they present their works :)
Every artist has his/hers own way of doing it, but does it make it less worth does it?
And yes of course, it's the Military Meshes forum, but I hope not only Military Meshes Pro forum.. please leave some slack for us the not so professionals too, and we might even pick up a trick or two :) and maybe get better

[denders]

Kev, looking forward to the next update.

[Lukem]

This is the second time this has happened to my knowledge - I apologise for any part I may have played in it.

I will soon embark on my first aircraft model and I look forward to any help that Ronnie, or anyone else can give me - as I said in my previous post (and have generally said in the past), if I know it's wrong, I will try and get it right, otherwise (for me, anyway) there is little point me spending months on a model.

Anyway, Any updates Kev? Looking forward to seeing the wings go on.:)

[kevjon]

Regarding the suggested changes, have a look at FFD modifiers. I am 100% sure you can get the knick and scale down canopy bubble in under 10 minutes using a single FFD modifier. It won't be perfect but it will look good enough, which is the main goal afterall as we all agreeI've had no luck with ffd modifiers in the past but will give it another try as it may work for this particular detail. Cheers for the suggestion. Regarding the canopy, I have already redone it to match the side profile of the Minoru plans. I decided after studying photos more closely that my Kagero canopy was tad tall and redoing this part was worth the effort.

Kevin, the discarding valid comments comment wasn't aimed at you but at some of the other folks who jumped the "who needs accuracy" bandwagon. I haven't picked up on anybody saying that but maybe you refer to some other thread. I think most people are saying lets not get to carried away with it as we all know, plans are not perfect and photo reference can be incomplete and skill levels and amount of time available varies.

Can we end this discussion now ? I've got a lot of mistakes to fix.:)

[kevjon]

Anyway, Any updates Kev?
Working on the cockpit at the moment, amazing how much time they sap up even putting minimal detail into them. I am hoping by the end of the weekend to have that wing on it.

[Skyraider3D]

I am hoping by the end of the weekend to have that wing on it.Good luck, looking forward to it :)

[kevjon]

Update with wing in place.

The wing was easy to do but the intake area was not and I had to spend quite a few hours of tweaking vertices & refining the mesh around this area. I think I'm pretty close to the real thing. Skyraider let me know your thoughts on it.

[VFXWest]

Hey Kevin your Corsair is really looking great!

You gotta make it a VMF-323 Death Rattler! My uncle was the CO of this squadron at El Toro Marine Air Station here in southern California in the mid 80's. They were still flying F-4 Phantoms at the time. But their first aircraft was the Corsair!

They had a pretty long list of Corsair aces as well -

http://home.inreach.com/tc/page4.html

[kiwi123]

Looks good Kev ! Are you going to model the landing gear and flaps as well ?

[Akio]

Nice going on kevjon.
Perhaps you already noticed,
"The Maru Mechnic" is bit old don't too trust.
but inside cutaway from mechanical manual is still useful.

[chrisken]

Very nice kev

[kevjon]

@VFXWest
I haven't started thinking about color schemes at this stage although all the 1A's seem to be in the tri color scheme.
Sounds interesting. I'll have a look through my references to see if I can find a profile or photo of VMF-323. I am quite keen to do a weatherbeaten machine with lots of tape around the cowling to stop the fuel leaking and one that is likely to have tangled with A6M3 Zero's.

@Kiwi
Definitely will be doing the flaps and all the wing detail. It is unlikely I will have the modelling energy to do the landing gear but I will be cutting out all the gear doors so that landing gear & wheel bays could be added later (if needed) without affecting any of the work previously done.

@Akio
Yep, we've had much debate in this thread about some aspects of the corsair drawings being inaccurate and Ronnie warned me not to use Maru Mechanic so those plans remain in their book. There is however lots of very useful detail drawings and photos in the Maru Mechanic book which have proved to be very good. I've generally used the Kagero plans on this Corsair and some parts taken from the Paul Matt and Matsuba Minoru drawings. From that I have 3D plane that looks to me like a Corsair and should render up Ok.

Cheers Chrisken.

[VFXWest]

This video might be little off topic, but I think it's good reference for anyone who wants to model a Corsair.

It mentions a few items that were brought up earlier. It looks like s-turns were necessary while taxing on a runway to see past the long nose. It also mentions the correct settings to compensate for engine torque.

At the end it shows the settings for a carrier takeoff. You can see the rear wheel bouncing off the ground as the engine is at high power with the brakes locked. It's pretty amazing... makes you wonder how many of those 13 foot props had to be replaced due to inexperienced carrier pilots.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6j-1EyouN0&mode=related&search=

[kevjon]

Thanks for the link VFXWest, will be interesting to some. I actually have the full version of this training video which is included on the Roaring Glory DVD about the Corsair. Evan actually put me onto those DVD's and they are very good if your interested about the plane and what it is like to fly from a pilots point of view.

Started working on the underside of the plane (where most of the detail is). Flaps and Ailerons cut out. Still lots of detailing to do in this area.

[denders]

Its looking real nice Kev.

[Skyraider3D]

Looks good to me, Kevin. You seem to have captured the characteristic curves of the intakes pretty decently. Cockpit area looks much better now as well.

Difficult to see from these shots, but the underside of the aileron cutout is quite different from the topside. There's a curve at the outer end on the bottom. I think you have it, though it looks a bit angular in these shots.

Two things that need some attention (I am sure you haven't gotten round to these yet) are the bottom wingroots (with catapult attachments and fairings) and the panel covering the exhaust pipes.

You're clearly getting on much better with this beast than me.

Roaring Glory DVD about the CorsairSounds like something I should get :)

[Nils]

For those interested, there is also a quite interesting pilot instruction video laying around on the net somewhere. I believe I once saw it through Google. It's about 1/2 hour long and lots of great shots both internal and external.

***
Found it: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1056703518162002454

[kevjon]

You seem to have captured the characteristic curves of the intakes pretty decently
Bit of guess work involved but about as good as I can get it.

Difficult to see from these shots, but the underside of the aileron cutout is quite different from the topside. There's a curve at the outer end on the bottom. I think you have it, though it looks a bit angular in these shots.
Thanks for that, I'll round off that out part of the underside of the aileron by sliding a few verts along their edges, I have cut it too straight but I have got the difference in width between the top and bottom of the aileron cutout correct.

Two things that need some attention (I am sure you haven't gotten round to these yet) are the bottom wingroots (with catapult attachments and fairings) and the panel covering the exhaust pipes. Yep, still to do. You can see a small part of my first attempt at these fairings which I have abandoned. I've decided to model those fairing seperately.
You've lost me with the panel covering the exhaust, what do you mean ?

@Denders and Nils
Cheers

[Evan]

Hope I'm not repeating myself too much but, that's looking great Kevin, nice detailing!

I'm glad you found the Roaring Glory DVD's good. The one I purchased on the P-47 is also very good, lots of old footage and documents.

[Skyraider3D]

I've just sent you an e-mail with some photos and drawings, which should clear a few things up :)

[Lukem]

That looks superb Kev!

Is there any chance of seeing the mesh around those intakes? I'm interested as to how you solved that particular area. I like the detailing underneath too.

[giant551]

Very clean Kev it almost looks like a photo of a real model kit with that grey plastic look:D Is it going to have the wheels as well ??

[kevjon]

Thanks Skyraider & Evan

Lukem
Cheers mate. Attached is the wire as requested. Final solution always looks reasonably simple but took me quite a few hours to get there.

Giant
Thanks. No landing gear planned at this stage due to the amount of time involved to do them and the wheel wells, inner gear doors etc. I may do them in the future if I have a need to do a take off or landing render. I must admit I do like the look of the corsair with wheels out and flaps down but have no photos that I can use as a backdrop which would be suitable for such a scene.

I'm a bit indecisive at the moment about whether I should invest in VUE 6 Infinite for that purpose to free me a bit from relying on Photos from airliner windows (which are usually too high anyway).

[Lukem]

Thanks for the wire mate.

You might be better going for the xstream version so you can integrate fully with max - I'm not sure what the price difference is off the top of my head though. I suppose it depends on how much you intend to do with Vue.

[giant551]

I don't know much about Vue, ive seen some good things out of it but is it easy to pick up?? I be interested to see how you get on with it.

[pete.cook]

If you're interested in finding out about it Paul, the PLE (http://www.e-onsoftware.com/try/vue_6_ple/) version is now available to download.

[kiwi123]

We're using Vue for a project at the moment (backgrounds only), it's ok, but not amazing. I think Terragen2 would be a safer (if more complicated) bet.

[kevjon]

We're using Vue for a project at the moment (backgrounds only), it's ok, but not amazing.

I suspected as much. I haven't seen any images produced with it that really reach the standard I'd like although this ones pretty good. http://www.e-onsoftware.com/showcase/Pictures/Nature/river.jpg.

These sorts of images would be great for flying over jungles. Maybe photoshop them a little with slight blur to take off the crsip cg look.

Thing I don't like about Terragen 2 is that it doesn't include vegetation, you have to purchase something else for that and then I don't know how good it is and how well they work together.

I've downloaded PLE so play around with it for a while and see if its worth buying.

[kiwi123]

The vegetation in Vue really is rather bad !

[Lukem]

That's true - I bought Vue Esprit 5 sometime ago; not very good for european vegetation certainly (you have to pay extra for an oak tree? What's that all about?).

Don't you have to pay for Terragen now?

[kevjon]

Don't you have to pay for Terragen now?
You've always had to pay for Terragen if you want to render larger images, incl T2.


The vegetation in Vue really is rather bad !
Thanks, saved me some time trying to learn it only to be disappointed. Just hoping there was some way past the enviroment problem for 3D work. Better keep working on the painting skills.

[Evan]

I think, from my limited knowledge, most Matte Artists who use programs like Terragen and Vue also do a lot of "paint over" to get acceptable results. The Raw images still look to CGish. Probably not so bad for animations but as still backgrounds a lot of work would be needed to make them more realistic.

[kevjon]

Thanks Evan. I wasn't thinking of using either Vue or Terragen to get photo realistic results but was more thinking of using them in conjunction with 3D aircraft for artistic renders. It may be easier and a lot cheaper to just paint the backgrounds much like Jerry Bouchers work, so I'll give that a go as well.

Here is an update. I think I've completed everything now except the engine (which is next). I also want to add a little more cockpit detail too.

[chrisken]

Very nice kev

[Skyraider3D]

Looking good indeed. One area still needs some attention though, and that's the exhaust stack area. It still looks like it's missing part of the cover panel.

[VFXWest]

Hey Kev -

I can't believe how fast you work! Your first post was on 6-10... so, we can expect the engine in what?...2 days? Textured by next week? haha

I've been trying to find reference shots of VMF-323 but its been really difficult. They really didn't start fighting until spring of '45. But they got 124 kills and produced 12 aces during the battle of Okinawa. That might be a Corsair worthy of your Zero!

Anyway... great job!

[kevjon]

Chrisken and Skyraider
Cheers

VFX West
No worries, if it was 1945 it is most likely to be a 1D version of the Corsair which would have tangled against A6M5 Zero's. I may do the 1D version in the future as the conversion from 1A should be pretty easy. The conversion of my zero's mesh to A6M5 is a lot of work but is on my todo list.
I can't believe how fast you work
Yep, this plane so far has gone really smoothly and fallen together nicely. I guess that comes down to experience gained on previous aircraft.

[chrisken]

Looking good indeed. One area still needs some attention though, and that's the exhaust stack area. It still looks like it's missing part of the cover panel.

Kev I think Skyraider is talking about the small cover forward of exhaust pipes ,you may want to fit it.

[Nils]

Nice images Chris :)

[kevjon]

Skyraider and Chrisken. The panel cover is there and has been there all the time. It must be the angle of this render which makes it look like it is not there or only partially there.

Chris, the photos you've posted are a great angle being almost square on. I'll recheck I have the shape of my exhaust cutouts correct using these photos as the ones I modelled from originally were a much more oblique angle making the task a more difficult to get the shape right.

[chrisken]

Hi Kev
Yoy are right the angle makes it hard to see. Once again it is a great mesh

[mrys]

Congrats Kevjon! Well deserved header!:)

[VFXWest]

Nice to see your Corsair in the header today.

Great job!

[kiwi123]

Congratulations Kevin ! Now texture that baby !

[cobra6]

Congrats on the header kev :)

Cobra 6

[giant551]

well deserved:)

[kevjon]

Thanks for the header guys, I don't think I've had one before.

Now texture that baby
Just got to do the engine and finish the cockpit first but I'm looking forward to seeing it with the tri color scheme in place myself. This will be a good weathering challenge which means I'll have to texture bake stuff to deal with texture seams...oh joy.

[Hitori Kyo]

Congrats on your first header Kevjon.

- Hitori Kyo

[digiartist]

the corsair's looking beautiful, well done on the much deserved header!

[Skyraider3D]

I don't think I've had one before.No kidding?! I looked through the archive and indeed you seem to be right! :eek:
Well, let's hope we can make a habbit out of headering your work then! ;)

[kiwi123]

I found that a bit surprising as well ! Your zero should have been up there also...

[Lukem]

Well deserved FIRST header mate!:D Can't believe it's your first BTW.

The detailing underneath is superb, or have I already said that?

[kiwi123]

Yeah, best 3d corsair ever :)

[denders]

It looks great! And congratulations on the header!

[Mirko]

Great!!
Congratulations on the header, Kev!

:salute:

[zenmarcel]

It seems to go to a very very coll one, Kev !
Sorry, I've not gone through all your topic(s), what is your goal/project with this Corsair ?
To answer you, mine is to simply demonstrate how is working a "star engine", and I wanted to use the P&W r-2800 as an exemple, and finih the work with a little realistic flight sequence.

Z.

[kevjon]

Cheers everyone, thanks for the congrats on the header.

@zenmarcel
Goal of the project is an inflight renders of the aircraft and a render with my already completed A6M3 Zero. The aircraft is also modelled in such a way that it could be animated if ever needed.

[zenmarcel]

OK, great !!!
Hope we'll see some animation ;o)

Z.

[Galgot]

Oh well i'm a bit late, but :
Congrats for the header kevjon ! :)

[krazycolin]

i'm even later...

congrats. well deserved.

[Martocticvs]

Not as late as me, though - congratulations!

[3dpointcloud]

I did not follow this aircraft, but looks great! I look forward to the reaslistic mapping of fastener/oil/grease textures.

I laser scan aircraft and other objects. When I got the first demo scan, before purchasing the scanner, we scanned the Grumman Goose at the Palm Springs Air Museum, California US. They also have a nice layout of the Corsair and a hugh mural behind it. Check out their site.

For future modeling, consider scanned data for cross-sections. You can also use the free program Rapidform BASIS for making some measurements on the scanned data.

Wendell Olson
Aeronautica3D
www.3dpointcloud.com

[VFXWest]

Well, I tried not to post because I know you are hard at work on the engine and textures...but...

where's an update???

haha

[kevjon]

Haha,

Just taking a short break from the Corsair while I finish off my Flitzer (http://www.military-meshes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1540). Should be back onto the Corsair in a couple of weeks time.

[kevjon]

Finally got the engine modeled and textured. This engine is very simplified and some stuff I made up due to lack of reference but looks fine once in place. I went a bit further with modeling and texturing the engine than I normally do as I have plans in the future to do some of the aircraft that also used this power plant.

Next step now is uv mapping the aircraft.

[kiwi123]

wow, nice work !

[VFXWest]

Wow that looks awesome Kev!

It looks like your Zeros are already diving on that Corsair!

[Skyraider3D]

Though not entirely accurate, that engine will do the trick nicely!

One thing you may want to change for the Corsair only is the ring from which all ignition wiring comes. On the Corsair this is flattened (semi-rectangular crosssection), while on most other R-2800 equiped aircraft it's round like you have it now. Check my Corsair engine (http://home.wanadoo.nl/r.j.o/skyraider/gallery/corsair_2wip.jpg) and this Corsair engine walkaround (http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/AWA1/301-400/walk375_PnW_R-2800_8w/walk375.htm) for reference.

The stuff on top of the gear housing also looks different from the real thing, but it will hardly ever show in the renders, being in the darkest corner of the cowling.

Nice update!

[jkbon]

waw good job !

[Lukem]

Superb Kev! I really like the texturing on the engine - shame quite a bit will be hidden by the cowling.

[Evan]

I think you missed a couple of bolts on the do-dang near the whatchamacallit :)

Nicely modelled and textured Pratt & Whitney Kevin!

[Deetz]

Excellent Kevjon, you're engine is looking fantastic! Definitely inspiring, I'll have to work hard on mine as well :)

Deetz

[kevjon]

Cheers everyone, I'm glad you liked the engine. I know very little of it will show in the final renders but it was kind of fun to model and little project in its own right.

by Skyraider
One thing you may want to change for the Corsair only is the ring from which all ignition wiring comes. On the Corsair this is flattened (semi-rectangular crosssection)
My research and references don't back that claim up. If you go to the powerplant section of the maru mechanic book, you'll see round ignition harness on a wartime photo of a corsair (could be a staged photo of a restored one...but who knows). The detail and scale book I have on the corsair also shows round. Wartime photo on page 68 of Kagero's Corsair Vol.1 also shows round and that is definitely not staged.

The stuff on top of the gear housing also looks different from the real thing, but it will hardly ever show in the renders, being in the darkest corner of the cowling. On page 19 of squadron signals F4U Corsair in action shows a wartime photo of the F4U-1A very clearly with good lighting on the engine and I think what I have modelled is indictive of the parts that existed on that engine. The magnetos and parts on top of the gear housing in that photo look the same as the color engine photos in the Detail and Scale book.

I have found no wartime reference photos to show the type of ignition harness you are modeling.

[Skyraider3D]

My research and references don't back that claim up. If you go to the powerplant section of the maru mechanic book, you'll see round ignition harness on a wartime photo of a corsair (could be a staged photo of a restored one...but who knows). The detail and scale book I have on the corsair also shows round. Wartime photo on page 68 of Kagero's Corsair Vol.1 also shows round and that is definitely not staged.You are right, I had the F4U-1D series in my head, while you're doing the -1A series.

The -1A had the R-2800-4 with round ignition harness, while the -1D had the water-injection equipped -8W (or -B) model which has the flattened type ignition harness. The F4U-4 has the -18W with round one again (but lots of other changes!).

My sources (for the -1D) were a R-2800B factory drawing plus photos I took of the British Corsair preserved in the FAA Museum. This machine is perhaps the most genuine Corsair in extistence.

In the end identification of the R-2800 series sub-types is an absolute minefield anyway, and yours definitely looks like one! :)

[kevjon]

Thanks for the info.... that answers a lot of questions I had about which version of the R2800 went into which version of the corsair. Just about every photo you can find on the R2800 shows a different version and stuff on the gear housing....absolute minefield as you say.

If I convert my corsair to a 1D, I'll have to remember to change the ignition harness and magneto's to match your linked reference.

[Skyraider3D]

If I convert my corsair to a 1D, I'll have to remember to change the ignition harness and magneto's to match your linked reference.Let me know when you do and I'll send a few photos your way.

[Mirko]

Very nice work on your engine, Kev!
Are the cylinders of the Pratt & Whitney modelled or textured?

:salute:

[kevjon]

Cheers Mirko

In order to save polys the engine cylinders only have 1 iteration of subdivisions. The cooling fins are represented with a strong bump map.

[kevjon]

UV's have been completed.

[Evan]

Looks good Kevin! Now for the fun bit...

[Skyraider3D]

Looks pretty good, but don't forget to move the flaps and ailerons back a little on th UV layout, or you'll end up with overlapping UVs.

[Lukem]

Looking forward to the paint-job Kevin:)

[Hitori Kyo]

Good fortune in your texturing Kevjon.

- Hitori Kyo

[kevjon]

Thanks guys

I have completed all the panel lines and blocked in the main colors. Still much to do on the texturing. Next thing to do is the bump mapping for the rivet lines and fabric covered surfaces.

[Skyraider3D]

I wish I'd gotten this far yet :)
Looks good.

Btw, maybe add simple ribs to the inside of the cowling, as it looks a bit empty from this particular angle.

[chrisken]

You are really getting the hang of this kev,nice paint job

[Deetz]

Fantastic! Waiting for more! :)

Deetz

[falcon012]

Beautiful work. You have made fantastic progress.

[kevjon]

Thanks guys...only the beginning but should look a lot better as I progress.

@skyraider
I wish I'd gotten this far yet
So do we....we all waited and hoped you would.
Btw, maybe add simple ribs to the inside of the cowling
Yep, I agree. I will be making a inner cowling with simple ribs to give the impression of detail there.

[zenmarcel]

I just want to say....... Wow ;)
Congrats for your P&W !

[VFXWest]

Hey Kev that looks awesome!

I can't wait to see the final scene with your Zero... have 2 headers with 1 project been achieved before???

Great job! Tim

[Lukem]

@ VFXWest: Yes

Looks great Kev - looking forward to seeing more:)

[Baron]

Hi Kev!

Looks great, as usual!

Maybe interesting for you and others: The Pilot's Handbook

http://www.tailwheel.nl/downloads/f4u1an0145ha1small.pdf

Cheers,

[jimmymugurel]

Hi Kev!
Fantastic job!
A friend of mine who is building RC need some cockpit fotos about F4U-1A
Can you help me?
Your's
JIMMY

[kevjon]

Thanks everyone, hopefully update in a couple of days.

@Baron
Great link, pilots handbooks are always very useful for a project.

@jimmymugurel
See Barons link above, just about the best reference material on the Corsair cockpit you'll get including the 1A.

[jimmymugurel]

Thank's Baron!
Thank's Kevjon!
Endeed a fine site!
Pilot's manual remains sometimes the only reference for the old WWII planes ( unfortunately ).
Your's
JIMMY

[kevjon]

Update time.

Here is the factory fresh version of the Corsair I've chosen to do..... "Big Hog" from VF-17 based Ondonga Nov 1943. Flown by Lt Cdr John Blackburn.

Next up will be the weathering....always challenging.

[Mirko]

Hi Kev,
Looks really cool so far. Look forward to seeing the final render of it.
What are you going to do with it?


:salute:

[Galgot]

Very well done ! a brand new Corsair out of the shop :)
me think the owner will dirty it quickly ( and nicely ) though ;)

[denders]

Nice Corsair!!! Kev!

[Deetz]

Wow...the bump map looks amazing, such fine details. :cool:

Deetz

[MagnumHB]

Here is the factory fresh version of the Corsair I've chosen to do..... "Big Hog" from VF-17 based Ondonga Nov 1943. Flown by Lt Cdr John Blackburn.

You mean Ondongo and Tom Blackburn? ;)

[Lukem]

Nicely done Kev - can't wait to see the weathering!

How badly scratched-up did these planes get, when compared to Jkbon's Rufe?

[Skyraider3D]

Looking very good!
The fabric strips look a bit painted-on currently, but I assume that will change once you weather them.

[kevjon]

Thanks everyone

@Mirko
Plan is to put this corsair into some renders and a scene with my A6M3 Zero. Once I finish this project I need to spend some time doing some renders of the Corsair, Flitzer and A6M3 Zero.

@Magnum
Yep, its written wrong in the book I have.....it should be Ondongo.
Looks like he used his middle name "T" for Tommy most often but his first name is John. Some good reading here (http://www.acepilots.com/usn_blackburn.html) about the Jolly Rogers...I might see if I can track down his book for some more inspiration.

@Lukem
How badly scratched-up did these planes get, when compared to Jkbon's Rufe?
These planes were reasonably weathered and look faded in B&W photos but don't appear to have heavily chipped paint although paint chipping is noticable in some areas. Weathering for me will be quite challenging to get it to look right.

[MagnumHB]

@Magnum
Yep, its written wrong in the book I have.....it should be Ondongo.
Looks like he used his middle name "T" for Tommy most often but his first name is John. Some good reading here (http://www.acepilots.com/usn_blackburn.html) about the Jolly Rogers...I might see if I can track down his book for some more inspiration.
I have that book, and I strongly recommend it. It's essential reading for any VF-17 project.

[VFXWest]

Hey Kev

Thanks for that link. After reading it, it sounds like you can add quite a bit of oil all over your Corsair! I can't believe the leaking on the windshield was so bad that they would look for rain clouds for a quick wash!

BTW, your Corsair is looking great. You picked a great topic! The history of VF-17 is really good reading.

[Skyraider3D]

VFXWest, have you noted the little gap between the cowling flaps on top of the nose? This was one attempt at keeping the windshield clean (and improving forwards visibility). Another was taping over the seams of the fuel tank panel (the white lines in front of the cockpit). Fact is, the Corsair was a very filthy machine :)

[cobra6]

looking nice so far:)

Cobra 6

[VFXWest]

OH... so, that's TAPE! I was wondering about the comment you made earlier. I've been doing a lot of research on the Corsair lately and I like it more than ever. Although, it did have it's quirks.

I just bought this 4 DVD set. (http://www.thecorsairexperience.com/) I can't wait to hear some stories from the guys that flew it in combat. Watch the trailer... great stuff.

I've been wondering about those lines for a long time...Thanks

[digiartist]

Thats looking well sweet Kevin, you're bump map is spot on and with the weathering applied the finished model is going to look fantastic

[kevjon]

@Magnum

I have that book, and I strongly recommend it. It's essential reading for any VF-17 project.

I haven't been able to track it down in my local military bookstore but may order it if available on the net. Thanks for confirming its a good read.

@VFX
Thanks,
Bit of a oily aircraft but in photos doesn't look like it leaks any more than any other WWII aircraft but it will be a challenge to add this affect to my weathering.
I just bought this DVD set
Should be good viewing....enjoy.


@Cobra and Digiartist.
Cheers guys. Learning all the time and trying to improve my texturing with each aircraft.

[falcon012]

Beautiful job Kevin. Your model looks superb.

[giant551]

Nice one Kev its going to look great when its down and dirty!!:)

[kevjon]

Cheers Falcon and Giant

[kiwi123]

Come on Kev, show us the dirt !

[rwright142]

Kev, absolutely fantastic!

My friend JimmyMiguel in an earlier post mentioned I'm building a F4U-1A. It will be modeled to honor Lt. JG Jim Streig (VF-17 #3) and your pictures are a GREAT help. Thanks a lot for doing those.

I am looking for close-up cockpit pictures for the F4U-1A but I'm hitting a brick wall... I just cannot find any.

I have received the KD431 book and it has some good cockpit pictures but nothing close-up. I'm looking for even the smallest details like the switches, decals, placards, etc.

I compared the KD431 pictures with the 1D pictures I have and there are enough differences between them to 'bother' me. I know I'm probably overly critical but I want my cockpit to be as accurate as I can make it. I have even contacted the Vought National Archives to purchase some copies of microfilm.. Geez... I'm too anal huh? hahaha

I've also contacted the Planes of Fame museum in Chino, CA and am awaiting a response...

So, if anyone can help I'd GREATLY appreciate it...

Definitely keep this pictures coming because your #1 is helping me a lot!

Thanks again.

[kevjon]

Come on Kev, show us the dirt !I'll get there....eventually...patience.

@rwright
I don't model cockpits in any great detail in my 3D work as time spent doing it would be wasted as little of it is seen come render time and the pilot also hides a lot of stuff therefore I don't know the differences between the F4U-1A, 1, 1d cockpits. The pilots manual linked earlier in this thread should be helpful to you. The "Detail and scale book" on the Corsair by Birt Kinzey has good cockpit photos of the F4U-1A and 1D cockpit (in color) however the photos are not clear enough to make the writing on the placards.
I also have the roaring glory DVD on the Corsair available at Amazon which includes pilots instructions on how to operate the corsair which includes good modern and wartime footage of the corsair cockpit and all its controls which may be of use to you.
Research is one of the fun parts of scale or 3D modelling. Good luck in your search.

[rwright142]

@rwright
The pilots manual linked earlier in this thread should be helpful to you. The "Detail and scale book" on the Corsair by Birt Kinzey has good cockpit photos of the F4U-1A and 1D cockpit (in color) however the photos are not clear enough to make the writing on the placards.
I also have the roaring glory DVD on the Corsair available at Amazon which includes pilots instructions on how to operate the corsair which includes good modern and wartime footage of the corsair cockpit and all its controls which may be of use to you.
Research is one of the fun parts of scale or 3D modelling. Good luck in your search.

Yes, my research has helped me learn a lot about the Corsair. I have the books you mentioned (along with many others) but just have not found what I am looking for. I just now bought the Roaring Glory DVD - thanks for that tip.

Hopefully the POF will come through for me.

Thanks for the reply.

[Skyraider3D]

Odd... I replied earlier saying I have a Corsair manual which should have detailed info on the cockpit, but my reply seams to have vanished.

Anyway, I'll have a look this weekend to see if there's anything of use.

[rwright142]

Skyraider3D,

Are you referring to the Pilot's Handbook (FOI)? If so, page 3 shows the cockpit left side but it is not of a 1A. It has the 1D manual drop tank and bomb release (number 3 in the manual) whereas the 1A is different. I could be way off base here, but the 1D's I have sat in are like the manual shows, but the KD431 book shows their FG-1A without this part, and has others that I need to identify.

Also, page 57 shows the Bomb Switch Box for arming and release a L.H. and a R.H. bomb. If I am correct, the 1A did not have 2 bomb, just a centerline?

Anyway, I would gladly appreciate anything you could find as I am probably way off base here. I just need to go back and read all of the books I bought.

Thanks for the reply!

[Skyraider3D]

It's the "Pilot's Manual for F4U Corsair". Photos seem to show the -1A model.

Anyway best start a new thread in the reference section (http://www.military-meshes.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=17), to avoid cluttering KevJon's post too much. :)

[rwright142]

Thanks, and will do.

[VFXWest]

Got dirt?

Big Hog v. Zero?

:eek:

[kevjon]

Just having a break from it while I do some paintings. I'll be come back to it though as it just needs the weathering and pilot.

[digiartist]

Kevin, I love seeing your painted work, but please mate, weather this beauty up and put it in some scenes, it's so close and it's such a beautiful model :D