Me 209 - WIP

[mrys]

Here is few shoots of my Me 209 model. I started with it few years ago, but after famous "mrys PC crash" in 2004, when I lost most of my models in progress it was waiting for his turn to rebirth from ashes.

Now, my phisician said, that I'am totally wealth now, and can talk about it with people...;)

[Karras]

The next time, save to CD your work :lol: only a few cents $
Good job, which soft ?

[mrys]

I've learned that :err:... Some of them survived, but not in final stage, so I have to reconstruct some parts.

About Me 209: modeled in Rhino, textures Corel Draw/Photoshop, rendered (just draft quality, not final) in PovRay.

[roshent]

Yes !! love to see how you tackle the models. Although not familiar with the plane, and rather surprised about the tailwheel skid, do you use point editing of the NURBS surface? Since I think I can see some evidence of that underneath the pilots side window...or maybe better Q, why are the meshlines bent upwards underneath that cockpit window?? Also good to see that you have to use multiple parts as well to create a tailempanage, I thought it was due to my bad skills.

[kevjon]

Looks very good. I really like to see an image if possible of the curves you use to make up your wing and tailplane. I really like how you get the nice flowing curves around the wingtip and tail tips. They look very good.

Nice modelling job and interesting subject.

[mrys]

Work with curves in this model was a little difficult, cause was necesary to get soft, flowing lines of fuselage and blend between him and wings. Vertical stabilizator was one piece with fuselege. I was a little lucky with it.

Here some photos from work.

[giant551]

A very nice insight on how you tackle your rhino modelling :D especially the underside of your wing/fuselage joint:D nice model:D

[kevjon]

Thanks mrys, very interesting to see how you go about setting up the curves for your nurb surfaces. How do you do your wingtips. Is it done with loft, networkcrv, 1 rail sweep or 2 rail sweep ?

I've never been able to solve the problem in Rhino.

[mrys]

Thanks mrys, very interesting to see how you go about setting up the curves for your nurb surfaces. How do you do your wingtips. Is it done with loft, networkcrv, 1 rail sweep or 2 rail sweep ?

I've never been able to solve the problem in Rhino.

It depend on model. Sometimes I use 2 rail sweep, sometimes curve network. And sometimes it is hard way in joining few methods in one element. In few models I was able to get whole wing (with tips) only by 2 rail sweep. NURBS has a problem with sharp edges. The only way to get it is to make wingtip in two pieces: top and bottom. When I'll be back home I'll look for something to show about.

[kevjon]

Posted by mrys
In few models I was able to get whole wing (with tips) only by 2 rail sweep.

This method works everytime but you end up with a flat high point where the two rails meet at the wingtip. Not so noticable on pointy wing aircraft (like the spitfire) but rounded wingtip aircraft it looks bad IMO.

Your Hurricane wingtips look really good on your gallery post, I'd like to see how you did the wingtips on this aircraft. Any further knowledge would be much appreciated.

[mrys]

This method works everytime but you end up with a flat high point where the two rails meet at the wingtip. Not so noticable on pointy wing aircraft (like the spitfire) but rounded wingtip aircraft it looks bad IMO.

Your Hurricane wingtips look really good on your gallery post, I'd like to see how you did the wingtips on this aircraft. Any further knowledge would be much appreciated.

Agreed. Making whole wing in one pass sometimes gives bad results. Not only in wingtips but also in wing profile (looking from forward), which is usualy to thin in end parts. Spitfires wings are almost ideal for this method, but in Hurricane I made it another way. There are morning in Poland now and I'am at my office, but on evening I'll try to write a little about how I made Hurricane's wingtips. If it will help you I will be very happy:).

[kevjon]

Thanks mrys.

I know these kind of requests take time to do. So much appreciated for your assistance. I am currently modelling again in Rhino as the Powernurbs plugin for max allows you to import the Rhino model straight into max and then convert to a good mesh. It has settings that allow you to convert your nurbs model to a mesh that can be anything from low to high poly. I am modelling a whole aircraft in Rhino at the moment so I can try out the Powernurbs meshing utility further to see if it has any weakness or flaws. If not it could be the answer to the problem of not being able to get a good clean mesh from Rhino itself.

The two most troublesome areas in Rhino for me have been wingtips and the fillets/blends between wings/tailplane/fin and fuselage. Once I have these things solved in Rhino I should be able to cut my modelling time for a whole aircraft from anything from 1/4 to 1/10th of the time it takes via sub-d/meshsmooth. That is provided the powernurbs meshing utility works well.

BTW I like the work you are doing with Rhino and the WIP's you have going on your site. All very good stuff. This one looks good too.

Posted by Giant551
A very nice insight on how you tackle your rhino modelling especially the underside of your wing/fuselage joint nice model

Very true, thanks for posting the images of how you create your surfaces to define the shape of the aircraft. Very insightful for us intermediate level users who want to know more.

[digiartist]

mrys, going to be a lovely model when it's finished. I do have a question regarding the Me209 though if you could help. I've never really thought about this until looking at your model but how did the 209 move around on the ground with a tail skid rather than tail wheel?

[Skyraider3D]

Marek, another great subject! I've always liked the Me 209 (both varieties) and glad to see it in 3D.


Gareth, yes the Me 209 (V1~V4) has a tailskid.


PS. David Myhra's book of the Me 209 has a great colour walkaround of the Me 209 V1 in the aviation museum in Krakow (http://www.thomasgenth.de/ueberlebende/Me209_Krakau/me209_krakau.html). Perhaps you have seen this machine yourself?

[digiartist]

Yeah, I've seen that book, amazing to see the walkaround photos too! Ronnie, how did it take off with that tail skid?

[mrys]

David Myhra's book of the Me 209 has a great colour walkaround of the Me 209 V1 in the aviation museum in Krakow (http://www.thomasgenth.de/ueberlebende/Me209_Krakau/me209_krakau.html). Perhaps you have seen this machine yourself?
Yes, I saw it, but it is very difficult to see, cause remains of the plane are in storage and waiting for (possibly) reconstruction. In fact there are only part of fuselage are in Krakow.

By the way if enyone would be in Poland should visit Museum of Aviation in Cracow. There are many interesting planes, PZL P-11C, PWS-26 but also fuselage of Udet's Curtis Hawk and some planes from I WW (Camel for example).


mrys, going to be a lovely model when it's finished. I do have a question regarding the Me209 though if you could help. I've never really thought about this until looking at your model but how did the 209 move around on the ground with a tail skid rather than tail wheel?

In fact it had not much to move around the ground, cause it was built only for record flight, so skid was enough. It is worth to say, that Me 209V-1 - V4 is totlly diferent from Me 209V-5/V-6. The last one was to be succesor of Bf 109. Me 209V-1 - V3 were experimantl planes for high speed record flight. Me 209V-4 with increased wingspan was a "propaganda fighter".

[mrys]

Many interesting photos of remains of Me 209 are in book published by AJ-Press:

http://aj-press.home.pl/ml44_euro.htm


Also good drawings included. I based partialy on them, but photograps forced me to make some improvements. It is six volumes monography of Bf 109. Some of volumes was published in english also, but I'am not sure if this one.

And to be fair - address of museum: http://www.muzeumlotnictwa.pl/indexen.php

[Spinner]

Yeah, I've seen that book, amazing to see the walkaround photos too! Ronnie, how did it take off with that tail skid?

Most WW2 era aircraft the pilot locks the tail wheel for tale off. Most WW1 era aircraft used tail skids rather than wheels. So its not that unusual a feature.

[Skyraider3D]

Pre-1940 almost all fighters had tail skids. Take off was from grass then, making the difference between a wheel and skid is neglegible :) (skid being simpler, lighter and having less drag tho'). Even the Spitfire prototype (http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/wwii/photos/gallery_005/Spitfire%20prototype%20K5054%20prior%20to%20first% 20flight%20-%201936.jpg) had a skid.